Opinions Matter with Adrian & Jeremy

00:00 It's Ireland's most talked about podcast. The only podcast with live callers and live debates. It's Opinions Matter with Adrian and Jeremy. 00:12 You're very welcome to this latest Opinions Matter podcast with Adrian and Jeremy, recorded live at our studio at the White Sands Hotel in Port Marnock in North County, Dublin. Now, we have an interesting conversation for you on the podcast today. 00:29 And it's all to do... One which has never been discussed before. No, that's actually true. 00:33 This is literally... Never discussed before? Ever. Anywhere, I don't think. 00:38 And it is whether or not a mother... 00:42 Of children, obviously. Well, obviously, you wouldn't be a mother of anything else. A mother with young children should ever be jailed and leave their children motherless, essentially, without a mammy to look after them. Because you may be aware of a story from a couple of weeks back where a woman... and her brother were jailed for a violent assault of two men at a hotel in Limerick in November 2023. 01:12 This is the case of Alison and Bill Chalk. 01:16 So Charlie Chalk's kids. Now, everybody listening to this podcast will have drank in one of his pubs. He owns the Dropping Well in Milltown, where I would be seen regularly. He owns the Orchard in... 01:31 He owns the Oval in Dublin City Centre. 01:34 A load of pubs all over the country. 01:36 They're a well-known family and a well-to-do family and a very rich family as well. 01:41 Anyway, Alison Chalk and her brother Bill were jailed in July for assaulting two men at a luxury hotel in November of 2023. The judge sentenced her, and we want to talk about her in particular, to two years and two months. So 26 months. 26 months. With 14 months taken off it, yeah, automatically. So she's down to a year. 02:08 And she was jailed only a couple of weeks ago. And guess what? She's out already. 02:13 She's literally out of prison within weeks of being jailed. 02:18 So just to make it clear, her exact sentence when you take into account, you know, suspended sentence and stuff. The amount of time she was supposed to do in prison was 12 months, which I thought was very low. The assault, by the way, lads, if you've ever read the details of the case, it was absolutely vicious. Didn't she bite? She did bite one of them, yeah. There was stamping on heads. She kicked somebody in the head. Yeah, it was just a vicious, vicious, vicious assault by her and her brother on innocent parties. 02:46 And... 02:49 She was supposed to do 12 months behind bars, and it was revealed yesterday that she got out after four weeks. Now, there was absolute uproar and revulsion over that, including by myself. When I saw that, I said to myself, oh my God, that is absolutely disgraceful. 03:06 Okay, do you think she was released because she's a rich kid? Do you think she was released because she's a mammy? Why do you think she was released? 03:14 Well, the Department of Justice said to the journalist, they said, we can't, which is such a cop, but we can't comment on individual cases. So they're never going to say, oh, we let her out because she's Charlie Chalk's daughter, or we let her out because she's a well-to-do mother who lives... 03:28 Okay, but one of the reasons that somebody will be released is if they're viewed as not a danger to society. And that is one of the reasons that she obviously was released, because she's not viewed as a danger to society. 03:39 So they would have looked at that case and said that was a moment of madness and the chances of it happening again are fairly slim. That doesn't matter. That's bollocks as far as I'm concerned. The fact of the matter is the victims, that is, what happened yesterday is a kick in the teeth for the victim, the two victims of that crime. 03:58 Okay, so Sinn Féin, on the one hand, are saying this is a disgrace. The prison system isn't doing its job. The prison system is saying we're overcrowded. She was in Limerick Prison, in the female section of Limerick Prison, and there's a capacity of 56 beds. 85 are being used now. So there's 85 people in custody, so an awful lot more. 04:21 Sinn Féin gone ballistic about it, but the Social Democrats, get a load of this. This is Gary Gannon. 04:27 Who I like, by the way. I'm disappointed with him over this because I've always liked Gary. I've always gone well with Gary. 04:33 He said he doesn't believe prison is the right place for a woman who has children. And he said he believes her early release is appropriate. 04:44 Now, she is a mother. She does have children. Three children. Three children. Three young children. 04:50 That were left without their mother while she was in jail for, albeit, a couple of weeks. 04:55 Well, she should have thought of that when she was biting... No, hang on a second. She should have thought of that when she was biting the cheek off of some innocent poor old soul. 05:03 No, hang on a second, because we need to speak up about this. This is a two-tier justice system, because if she was Jacinta from Ballyferma, for argument's sake, people would be looking at this a completely different way. Because they saw photographs of her lovely house online and saw that she lives in a huge house in leafy suburbs, South County Dublin, and because her father is a well-to-do person, it doesn't matter. Is that the reason you believe she was released? 05:30 Because she's not your stereotypical scumbag inmate. 05:33 Yeah, yeah, yeah, I do believe that. I do believe that because there are... She was released because she's a posh kid. And probably what you're saying is right is that they probably think she's not going to do that again. I mean, she's brought shame on the family. She brought shame on herself. 05:46 Yeah, highly likely to real fans. Or highly unlikely, should I say. 05:49 It's been all over the news for the last couple of months. And, you know... 05:54 Okay, but I want to focus in on what Gary Gannon had to say, and that was he doesn't believe prison is the right place for a woman who has children. Let me focus on that. 06:05 He was talking about smaller sentences. He wasn't talking about murder and stuff. 06:08 No, no, obviously, yeah. 06:10 So even though the crime that her and her brother commissioned was vicious, absolutely animalistic behaviour, the way the two of them behaved, it was on the lesser. So it wasn't murder, it wasn't manslaughter or anything like that. It was, I can't remember the exact sentence and what the charge was. But anyway, it was assault. So it was a smaller sentence. But letting someone out, and no, I don't blame her, by the way, I don't blame Alison Chalk. No, obviously not. 06:42 If I was locked up and someone knocked on the door of my prison cell and said, we'll let you go now. Oh no, I'd rather do my full sentence. So she's happy as Larry. 06:50 Okay, but again, do you believe that prison is the right place for a woman with children? That's the simple question. It's the right place for a woman with children who commits a crime. 07:00 She committed the crime But obviously it's not a place for somebody who didn't commit a crime. No, but what I'm saying is she's there because of her own actions, nothing else. No, I understand that. But you can still punish somebody without actually having to jail them. 07:13 You could lob a really, really heavy-duty fine on them, especially for somebody like her. She's not short of a few bob. 07:19 No, no, the money shouldn't be able to, no, stop, stop this. This idea... That money should be able to buy your way out of a serious crime is absolute bollocks as well. She committed a serious, serious crime. She was sent down for a year. And after four weeks, Jesus, the bed in the prison was probably not even warm at this stage. Literally after four weeks, she gets to knock on the door of the cell. 07:45 Good news for you, Alison. It's home time for you. And then to add insult to injury, Gary Gannon saying, well, I think that was fair enough that she was let out of four weeks. Absolutely not. 07:56 He was very specific. He believes that it was appropriate to release her because she is a woman who has three young children. That's the bottom line here. 08:05 That the children in this case are the ones who are ultimately suffering because their mammy has been 08:11 taken out of circulation. Don't talk about children and she's not here to defend herself, in fairness. But that was Gary Gannon's point. But I would imagine, well, I know fairly certain, yeah, that the kids hadn't been taken into care around tonight. No, no, I understand that. They have a father that lives in the house as well. So it wasn't if the kids were after being taken into care. The kids were not in danger or anything like that. Mummy was going to be going away for 12 months. 08:38 and the kids would have been fine. So don't be making out here that the kids would have been... I can't believe this. And normally myself and Adrian will discuss our opinions on topics before we do this, but we didn't today. And I'm actually... 08:51 I'm actually... 08:53 Flabbergasted. Flabbergasted. That you're taking her side. I didn't say I was taking her side. 08:59 Sorry, at no point did I say I was taking her side. Jeremy, shut up for a second. 09:03 What she did was... 09:05 If she was an outjunkie from the inner city, you'd be saying throw away the kids. What she and her brother, by the way, let's not forget him. And mind you, he's still in prison. What the two of them did was vile. It was disgusting. It was a horrible crime. It was the lowest of the low, kicking somebody in the head. I mean, I need to say no more than that. About as low as you can go. So I'm not in any way excusing what she did. However, it does raise a question about whether or not it is appropriate to be jailing mothers with young children. 09:39 Because ultimately, it's the children are the ones that suffer. If somebody like Alison Chalk, as I said, the original sentence was 26 months, it was reduced to a year, and ultimately she served a couple of weeks. But is she going to go kicking people in the head again? Is she going to re-offend? Most probably not. 09:59 No, that part I will agree with you. The chances that she will commit a crime like that again, I'd say, and I'm sure the whole family at the moment are eating very humble pie because the embarrassment that this has brought upon the family that were well known and are still well known. I mean, he's a businessman in Dublin for years, Charlie Chalk. That's not the issue. 10:20 Shame isn't a punishment enough. Okay? The shame that she's carrying is not a punishment enough. And the two victims, the two victims that were, that probably have PTSD, probably can't go outside the door. 10:35 What sort of message does that send out? That the woman who bit the cheek off you is walking after four weeks. Four weeks! 10:42 Our number is 085-825-2626. 10:45 I know what four weeks is. You would actually sleep through that sentence. That's a long sleep. 10:50 There are some that would argue that she probably shouldn't have been incarcerated at all. 10:54 Who would argue that? 10:56 Gary Gannon. Gary Gannon literally said he doesn't believe prison is a place for women with children. 11:03 John, you better come on as well. 11:06 Like... I'm happy that she got off. She is a low risk of re-offending. 11:11 That's the point. That is exactly the point. Our number is 085-825-2626 if you would like to get involved in this conversation. Let me kick off the conversation with Trevor, who's a little bit angry. 11:27 So we all know that there's scum little poxes out there that go into the courts with child inappropriate images. And a certain judge, though we won't mention, seems to be favouring them, letting them off with suspended sentences. And then you have Tony down the road who hasn't paid his TV licence and he could get prison time. And now we have a mother who done a serious assault gets out early after a month. I don't know why a government minister or whatever the fuck he is is even commenting on this. 11:57 It's appropriate. Because she has kids. You're having a fucking laugh. So if she goes out and runs down a lot of people. And she just gets a slap on the wrist next. Like what's to stop anybody doing that. Saying oh I have a child. Or children. Wonder if it was a man. Would he get away with it. 12:14 Opinions matter. 12:38 A daily podcast from Ireland about opinions. 12:41 Looking to transform your home without breaking the bank? Visit Carpet Luxury Bedding and Furniture, Dublin's trusted family business with over 50 years of experience. Take advantage of their famous stairs and landing package deal. Just €500 supplied and fitted, including up to 16 square yards of quality carpet. Plus, discover fantastic deals on stylish laminate flooring, durable vinyl flooring, beds, mattresses, and furniture for every room. With free measuring and sample services, finding your perfect floor has never been easier. Visit Carpet Luxury Bedding and Furniture today or shop online at carpetluxurybeddingandfurniture.com. 13:15 Quality value and service you can trust. 13:17 Sarah, you're on Opinions Matter. How are you, Sarah? I'm good. 13:21 I'm good. How are you? 13:22 Good. Thanks, Sarah. You've heard this story about Alison Chalk. She was jailed for a year. 13:29 She is out within a couple of weeks. And one of the things that one of our politicians said is he doesn't believe prison is the right place for a woman who has children. You've been there and done that and worn the T-shirt of being in prison. 13:49 I have, yeah. I received a two-year sentence over, it was a cannabis charge. 13:56 And it was forced offence, forced anything. I'd never even been cautioned by a guard before this. I just got caught up in some stuff, as life does do sometimes. Silly mistakes happen. But I'd received a two-year custodial sentence. Nothing suspended off it. 14:16 And I had a young child at home. I was also three and a half months pregnant at the time of the sentencing. Now, the incident had happened two years previous to that. So fast forward two years, I find myself three and a half months pregnant, standing before a judge that was referenced there by a man that was on last. And... 14:38 straight off two-year custodial send her send her down and what I seen when I was on the inside is that it is a place for women and that's why women's prisons exist because women are just as capable of committing these crimes and having to deal with the repercussions of it regardless of whether you have the ability to reproduce or not, that does not factor into it whatsoever. 15:02 OK, now my understanding is that you actually went into prison. When you went into prison, you were pregnant. Is that right? 15:09 Yeah, yeah. 15:09 OK. And you were, fortunately for you, released from prison early, before you had the baby. 15:19 Yeah, I was released four and a half months into the two year sentence, which I was extremely grateful of. Much like Alison, I wasn't going to turn around and go, no, thank you. I'd like to stay. I'd like to stay. But like that, There was people that had came in after me and had gotten out before me. 15:43 Some of these were repeat offenders and I was sitting there kind of going, is everyone forgetting about the pregnant one in the corner that's freaking out, that's not used to this environment, that's so far removed from this. It was not something that in my lifetime I ever thought was going to come about. So it was something so foreign to me. 16:02 And yeah, like four and a half months in there. Thankfully, I had the school and stuff to kind of throw myself into. I kept busy every day doing all that. But I like you mix around the yard, you get talking to people. 16:15 And one thing that is very common is a lot of the marimothers. And it is, I get it, the kids are the ones that suffer in the... in the parents getting themselves locked up absolutely but that's down to the parents that's down to the decisions that the adults are making 16:33 OK, so as you said, just like Alison Shaw, although not as early, you were released early from your sentence. You went off and you had your baby. But what you're saying is from your time inside, a lot of the women that were in there were mothers. My question today is, is it fair to be incarcerating women who have young children particularly? 17:00 I don't see it as any less fair than incarcerating someone that hasn't got children. 17:05 I feel like if you're... Well, because they're providing care to young children. When mammy is taken out of the picture, the children are the ones that suffer. 17:15 Oh, absolutely. But that's for the parents to think about before they're out here doing these things. That's not... That shouldn't be looked upon favourably because you've had kids, like... 17:27 So it should make no difference whether you have children or not? 17:31 I don't think so. I met a lot of women in there who had children and stuff and it makes no odds when you look at the crime that's being committed, especially the likes of violent assaults and stuff like that. 17:45 As parents, you should know better than to be going around assaulting people, biting people's faces, attacking people. It just, you shouldn't be looked on any more favourably because you've young kids at home. 17:57 And a couple of questions about your case, Sarah. What age was your... So you were pregnant with your second child, so you had a child on the outside. What age was your child on the outside when you went into prison? 18:09 He was five. 18:10 He was five. Now, what was... Did you tell him or... Because I know there was a lot of commentary about Alison Jock online saying, geez, I wonder what she told the kids and stuff like that. Does your five-year-old know anything about that or did you bother telling her? 18:23 No, he knows nothing. And like that, when the time comes in the future, if there's questions that arise about it, I plan to be... 18:32 as transparent as possible and to use this as a form of educating them against why not to get involved I was about to say that your story is obviously online and all the news sites I've seen the story it's one of those things you can't hide the story but where did they think Mammy was going to be going to be going and while you were in prison what care arrangements had you got for your child 18:57 But thankfully, his father had stepped up and stuff and had taken over most of the parenting duties. But my own family did. Like at the end of the day, he wasn't at fault in this. So they were like, you know what, we are going to rally around and we are going to make sure that he wants and needs for nothing in that time. So I was very fortunate in that sense that everyone was kind of saying, well, it's not his fault. He's not going to suffer through this. 19:26 But again, you were that woman with a young child who was jailed and you don't believe you deserved any more special treatment than any other inmate. 19:37 I'd say if you'd asked me at the time. 19:39 Yeah, I'm sure you would. 19:42 But in hindsight... Oh, yeah, absolutely. I thought, like, why aren't you letting me out now on my first night? Like, I just thought it wasn't for me. But I've had a couple of years to sit on this. And the fact of the matter is, I've even spoke to the arresting guards that have said, like, we didn't think it was going to be a custodial on the day. And everyone thought it was going to be a suspended sentence because it was a forced offence. I have said to them, I have no ill feelings. I hold no... 20:07 grudge against you because at the end of the day had I not been breaking the law it never would have happened and just looking at your case here as well I know you mentioned a few minutes ago which is more the most bizarre thing about your case well there's a lot of stuff bizarre about it and by the way people saying was she locked up for smoking cannabis no she wasn't it was it was possession with intent to supply is that what the yeah yeah I won't say much cannabis it was a lot of cannabis it wasn't just a little bag sure it wasn't it was a lot but the judge in your case was Martin Nolan it was yeah that is yeah like that just I can't get over that that the man the detectives the detectives and all on the day like all them when they were showing up in court they kept saying like listen 20:48 You've never done anything out of line before. This will be a suspended sentence. You'll get a very heavy caution here and stuff and no one's seen it going that way but the judge on the day deemed it fit so you can't 21:02 Yeah, but just when you see every second week in the news, the stories of Martin Nolan letting off people who've committed a lot more serious crimes than you have. Oh, yeah. 21:13 Oh, yeah, big time. 21:14 Yeah, as I said, you must unfortunately just got him on a bad day or something. 21:18 But again, Sarah, you don't believe in hindsight that you deserved any more special treatment than any other inmate who may not have had young children or may not have been pregnant. 21:31 No, I think like at the end of the day, it comes down to the crime. It comes down to the person committing it. And if it's deemed fit for a custodial sentence, whether you have reproduced and you have young kids or your kids are grown or you're an upstanding citizen the rest of the time, like you don't have crime. It's what happens. We want people who commit crimes to be carried out to the letter of the law. And that applies to everybody. 21:59 Let me ask you just on this, what was the one thing you learned from your couple of months in the Doka Centre? 22:08 Um... 22:09 Well, I learned that a lot of them were normal girls that life had gotten a bit crazy for, gotten a bit chaotic. 22:20 Sorry for cutting across you there, sorry. When you say a lot of them were normal girls, were any of them, and I know you don't know Alison Chalk, but you can imagine, I mean, she's from a well-to-do family. She lives in a lovely house in South Leafy, Dublin. Were any of them like Alison Chalk? Were they from that background? I'd be surprised if they were. No. 22:39 Not really any that I would have encountered. No, I didn't. It seemed to be more inner city girls than anything that have maybe had harsh upbringings, maybe were brought up through the care system themselves or had a lot of little pitfalls with life. Addiction was really prevalent in there. That's something that I've seen a lot of. 23:01 Okay, so again, just to go back to my question, what did you learn mostly? Obviously, not to end up there again, I assume, is one of the things you learned. But what else did you learn? 23:15 I think the big lesson, the big takeaway from it was... 23:21 how poor, well, one is how poor the addiction services are in Ireland, that this was one of the best places for people to end up because a lot of the girls would come in on a sentence nearly at death's door through addiction and stuff like that, really run down, really not looked after themselves and stuff. And within a couple of months in there, they're as healthy as they've ever been because they're being fed, they have a bed, they have all these other things. And when they get out, they haven't really got a lot and they fall straight back into it. 23:52 So one thing I learned was how poor our reintroduction into society services are for people that do slip between the cracks like that. 24:01 OK, so again, Alison Shark, a mother of three, released from prison after a month. You don't think that was right then, do you not? 24:11 No, I don't. I don't think. Well, I think like whatever about early releases due to overcrowding, that's something that generally can be helped. 24:20 And by the way, she wasn't in the docus. She was in Limerick. Yeah, she was in Limerick. In the women's section. And it is very heavily overcrowded. 24:28 Yeah, I do understand that. Yeah. But like that, even when I was in the docus, There was some cells that were a four to a cell. There's two beds. There was two mattresses on floors. There was people on my floor as well. And it was a fall hazard. You're getting up in the middle of the night to go to toilet. You're falling over, people. I have to say to governors, I'm heavily pregnant. I also have multiple sclerosis. I'm generally not the best on my feet at times. And... 24:55 it was like, OK, we'll move them to somewhere else. And then next of all, another cell had five people to it. 25:00 OK, so it sounds like a nightmare as well. 25:03 One of the things that Adrian said just finally was that he believes that it was OK to release Alison Chalk after four weeks because he believes that she's not at a high risk of re-offending, which is probably true. She's probably learned her lesson. But... Looking up on your case as well, Judge Martin Nolan, as he was sentencing you to two years, he said the exact same thing. Judge Martin Nolan said about you and the other person that it was very unlikely that you would re-offend as well, yet he still put you away. 25:34 Yeah, yeah. 25:35 Nothing suspended, no. I felt it was a very harsh sentence at the time. Even looking back, I... 25:44 I struggled because like that they had brought in something that if your sentence was less than 18 months that you were sentenced with, you could nearly put in for immediate temporary release when you got in. I didn't meet that threshold because I received the two year sentence and stuff. So it just felt a lot more like you're going to learn this and you're going to learn it the hard way. 26:05 Great to talk to you, Sarah. Thanks very much indeed for being so open and honest with us. Let me go to John. You're on Opinions Matter. How are you, John? How are you doing, Adrian? 26:14 How are you doing, Jeremy? 26:15 John, we've just been listening to Sarah who described how she was in prison. She was in the DOCA centre for possession of drugs with intent to supply. She realises what she did was wrong. But she doesn't believe having children should be enough of a reason for you to get out of prison early. 26:35 Well, she's only done for a half month, so she didn't do too bad either, you know. 26:40 No, she's the first to admit that. But again, she wasn't going to say no. She wasn't going to say, no, I'd prefer to stay here with the press. 26:49 Anybody will take their hand back. Anybody will have to get knocked early or get knocked early. But here's the thing, Adrian. You see, Jeremy made a very, very, you know, a huge point here to your mom when I was listening. that, oh, you know, if I had to be on anybody in the inner seat, or if I had to be on anybody, you don't, you know, they wouldn't get it. You know, I've already heard and they're telling me, you know, that there's a perfect point for you now that this guy has got early release. So I don't know what your point was on that. 27:16 Now, I tell you, I'm going to... What do you mean you don't know what my point is? 27:20 My point was, is that I asked Sarah there the question, where most of the women, if not all the women in the Doka Centre, were any of them like Alison Chalk, as in a privately educated, I think she went to a private school, I can't be sure, but a privately educated, upper class... A rich kid. A rich kid, where many of them... And she said, no, they're all from the inner city. 27:42 You know, what you said earlier on before, Sarah, you said it on the start of it when this show opened. You said that, you know, I wouldn't be here, and then I see you there, I wouldn't be anybody getting early release. 27:53 People are getting early release every day, you know, and we just don't hear about it. I'll tell you what we were hearing about this. It's because we know the Chalk family. Everybody in Dublin must be living on the rock if you don't know the Chalks. As you said, they're very successful business people. You know, there's just loads of business around the place. The only reason why we know about this is because how they are in the business world, I'd put it this way. You know, if Alison Shaw was just a normal Joe Soap, we wouldn't know about this. I mean, we'll be talking about it shortly today. The only reason we were talking about it is because... 28:25 Hang on, of course we'd know about it. There's stories of assault, people being knocked off assault every day, the week in the news. Do you not read the newspapers? 28:32 What we point is, the only reason why it's being highlighted is because who she is, Jeremy. 28:36 No, the reason is, John, that somebody is out of prison after only a month of a one-year sentence. Not a month. Not a month out of a year-long sentence. 28:48 But anyway, I ask you this, and I wonder this, you know. And if she, you know, when I'm the same as, you know, when they're in the same frame and when the Jew, Jeremy, or Asian, sorry, you know, she is on a very end of real fandom again. 29:01 And like, how do you, how do either of you, the more I think about that, how do either of you know that? How can you, you've never met the woman, neither of you have met the woman. No, no, no, listen. No, listen. I'm answering your question. She's never been in trouble before. 29:17 Does she have 130 previous convictions? No. 29:22 The two of you are sitting there like qualified criminologists saying no, this woman... 29:28 It doesn't take a qualified criminologist to notice that she's ready at the end of the list to re-offend and again, you know, I don't think Alison Chalk is going to go out and start doing what she's doing, you know, again and again and again, Jeremy. This is what my point is. And I think this is why even the order of criminal services let her out early. You know, if they score for one thing, for one infant, that they were going to release her and she was going to do this again, do you think she would have gotten out? No, she wouldn't have. Definitely not. 30:00 So the question and this is what Gary Gannon had to say. He believes that prison isn't the right place for a woman with particularly young children. He said he doesn't believe it's the right place and he believes her early release was appropriate. What do you say to that? 30:22 I believe in half of what Gary Garland, you look at this, it depends on the crime agent, I suppose, and it depends on what the crime is. 30:28 Well, let's talk about the crime. And the crime that Alison Chalk was convicted of was a serious, violent assault causing actual harm. 30:41 Yep. Very, very serious shit. You know, it was very serious shit. I'm even amazed she's out that early, but she's out. They released her. You know, and what's everybody's big deal? The woman is out. You know, okay, she's only done a month. And that's what you said earlier on. Oh, yeah, you better go on, John. I'll back up your boots. I'm delighted for her. Fucking fair juice for her. She got out early. I'm not... 31:03 Okay, but again, let's go back to what Gary Gannon said, and that is he doesn't believe prison is the right place for a woman who has young children. Now, do you agree with that? 31:18 I agree with, as I said, on certain terms of admissions and on certain, you know, what people do. You know, you're a woman and you, you know, you do a very serious crime, which that was a serious crime, I'm not doubting it. You know, at the end, as I said to you, Jeremy, and you said the same. So just... 31:34 That's not why a prison sentence is given. The length of a prison sentence is not given depending on whether the person will re-offend or not. 31:41 It's given as... 31:57 It is. The judge suspended 14 months of her sentence. That obviously was in the belief that this woman isn't really a threat to society. I'll give her a shorter... 32:13 actual term. 32:14 I'm not saying that this woman is a danger to society and I'm sure now that she's out she'll keep her head low, she'll be a good mother My wife wouldn't throw glasses and buy people on the cheek Look at the mirror to me this night wasn't there I can't comment on what happened that night So hang on, the evidence is there What I said, if that was your missus or your board You'd be fucking delighted she got out early 32:52 My board, as you said, wouldn't behave in such an animalistic way. 32:56 My missus wouldn't either. We should look here clear. I was listening to you yesterday and you were saying what you were saying. Does everybody not deserve a chance? Do you all get fucking amnesia when you go to bed? Everybody deserves a chance straight to me, no? 33:11 Again, John, let me ask you. Do you believe prison is the right place for a woman with young children? 33:19 Oh, yeah, yeah. Look, it's a double-barreled question, Ergin. Is it a place when they do time for killing someone? Yes, it is. Of course it is. It depends on the crime. It depends on the nature of the crime. It depends on, as I say, where I'll send them. It's everything. It depends on everything. So I can't answer that directly. There's a reason why you win them. And we see this, you know, through the courts as well, that women get, you know, and they do get a little lighter sentence because they have children at home. And we all see that. 33:49 And the judge always takes that into account. Well, judge, she's three kids there. She's a mother. She's probably on her own sometimes. Always read out in court when the judge before he sentenced a female to prison. And in his, nobody gets an enjoyment of sending a woman to prison. Nobody does. And I don't think any judge does. But we've seen what happened there with Judge Nolan fell out there with Sarah's case. Fucking lock her up and throw away the key. I don't think that was really fair on Sarah, to be honest with you. Sarah should have been given the same chance as Alison Shaw should have been. 34:20 Yeah, no, I think if you look at those two crimes, Alison Chalk's crime and Sarah's crime, although I don't agree with drug dealing, and that's what she was done for possession. She deserves the same, yeah. 34:32 She deserves the same. 34:35 same time as. 34:36 But you saying that she, that you were delighted to see her walking out of prison after four weeks because you know she's not going to re-offend. I'm agreeing with you that she probably won't re-offend. I'm agreeing with that, that she probably won't. As I said, she'll keep her head down and get on with her life and draw a line or that. But what sort of, but To do four weeks for an assault like that is bollocks. And it needs to be called out. It needs to be called out. 35:02 I get you, Jeremy, but I don't agree with Trevor much. And what Trevor said there at the start of the show, there was a message. You know, you see people going, you know, getting locked up for a fucking TV license. As I said, it's a kangaroo court system here in the underworld. I don't understand it either. I'm scratching my head sometimes. I'm like, how the fuck did that happen? And this prick is on you. You get me what I'm saying? 35:26 But again, to quote your words, and I'll read it back to you. I'm happy for her, for Alison Chalk. I am happy for her. Genuinely, I am. 35:33 I don't even know the girl. I'm happy for her. Are you happy for the V? 35:37 Are you happy? They must be shaking their head and disbelief for that. 35:40 I'm not, no. But at the end of the day, the judge, and I'm sorry, the oldest prisoner of service is saying that she should be let go. Here, what do you want me to do? Throw you out a fucking river. I don't know what you want me to say. You know, she was on a lower risk out of the offending and that's why they let her out. Of course, we have an overcrowding problem that someone mentioned later on. The prison services are in a shite. The traditional system is in a shite. So what you want me to say, what you actually want me to say, if that was my wife and she got off early, I'd be fucking tonight or two. 36:06 Of course I would. Okay, so again, prison... Women with children, yes or no? 36:13 Or sorry, women, if they're rich and from the south side of Dublin, they shouldn't be locked up. 36:17 Dublin got to do with being rich. There she got it, you know, early release soon. So I don't know why you keep going with the rich shit. I really don't. But look, anyway, you keep going with that one, Charlie. It depends, Adrian, that's what I said. It's a double barter's question you have to ask me. If it's on a lower case of re-offended, yes, give them the suspended sentences. Don't even clog up the prisons with them. Yeah, that's it. 36:41 All right, I want you to stay there for one second, John, and I want to get your reaction in a moment to this message, which I've been asked to play for you. 36:50 Good afternoon, lads. Should a mother not be thinking of those things before she does the crime? She knows she has children. So why is she doing the crime? If you don't punish her, then you're bringing the children up in the same scenario. She's going to continue the crime, like shoplifting. She's going to be bringing the child with her when she's shoplifting. The child is going to learn shoplifting. If it's drugs, the child is going to be around drugs and think it's OK. Yes. 37:19 If a person is a mother and does a crime, she has to be punished. 37:24 That will actually stop the knock-on effect for her child and other children to come along. Put them in prison. Let her learn a lesson. And if she doesn't learn the lesson after one or two times, take the children off her. Full stop. 37:42 It's the Opinions Matter podcast with Adrian Kennedy and Jeremy Dixon. A podcast from Ireland with a difference. 37:49 Jason, you're on Opinions Matter. How are you, Jason? 37:54 Hello? No. 37:57 No, he's not there. We'll try and get... 38:00 We'll try and get him back in a second. 085-825-2626 is our WhatsApp number. I'm always telling you not to be doing them on that. I'm always telling you that. 38:12 Jason, you're on Opinions Matter. How are you, Jason? Afternoon, Adrian. Sorry, I hit the wrong button. And now, Jason, what do you want to say on this? The prison say it's not what they're doing there. They were at risk assessment. 38:25 Why can't we tag them? 38:27 I mean, I don't understand that. Something like that should be tagged. But they let people out earlier. I don't know about that. 38:33 No, I'm aware of that. I'm aware of that. You'd be surprised. 38:36 You'd be shocked at so many people that come out. 38:38 No, but particularly in the women's sections because they're smaller, but they're actually much more overcrowded even than the men's sections. 38:48 Yeah. So, I mean, we have to let them. My question is, why is there always women with children? What about fathers? What about young fathers with children? Say that the mother's fucked off or the mother's no good. She's a junkie. 38:57 That's a good question, actually. 39:00 Gary Gannon was asked particularly about this case, and he commented on the fact that Alison Chalk has three young children, and he doesn't believe that prison is the right place for women with children. 39:14 What about men with children? Ask him that. I guarantee he won't be able to answer it. Do you want to know why? Because he couldn't tell you what a fucking woman was. 39:21 He believes anything can be a woman. But back to the prisons, I don't know why we don't tag these people. Low-risk offenders should be tagged. Peter Foil should be fucked in and kept in. Rapists should be fucked in and kept in. But the lads that are out there shoplifting, women that are out there shoplifting, what's prison going to do for them? It's costing us money. 39:40 What's the cost to hold a prisoner nowadays? 50 grand a year, is it? 39:42 In fact, now nearly 100 grand a year. 39:44 Is it? 39:45 Yeah. In fact, one of the comments on their original post on Facebook when we put this up about Alison Chalk was saying, and I'll read out the comment here, what good was locking that woman up going to do? 39:58 But you have to ask that question. No, you don't have to ask that question. You actually do. 40:03 So do you think that's a valid... Well, do you believe in... What do you believe prisoners are, Jeremy? Is it punishment or rehabilitation? Both. Well, I don't believe... Yeah. 40:10 Yeah, I think it's both. 60% punishment and 40% rehabilitation. I don't think anybody probably does rehabilitate in prison. No. No. 40:18 Very few. Very few. But they know people. Hang on for one second. I disagree with you. You look at Sarah, who we had on as the very first call. 40:26 She was basically saying that she learned never to go back there again. That's rehabilitation. 40:31 He's now my story. He's now my story. Yeah. I was there when I was fucking young. And it started me out. I was listening to the gobshires tell me how great you are, what a great thief you are, but what's our fifth sentence? And then you can't be that fucking good if this is your fifth time in here. So no, I mean, it rehabilitated me, but look at the, what do you call it? You know where people that go back in after going back out? 40:50 Re-offending rates, yeah. And that's for people that do less than two years. 40:54 Most of that is from people that do less than 10 years for stupid little petty crimes, car crimes, shop crimes, stuff like that. 41:01 I mean, we should be able to hide a lot of these and send a lot into open prisons. How's the risk? We have the technology. 41:07 I agree with you on everything you're saying. And let's look at what was achieved. Jeremy, I want you to deal with this. 41:16 This lady... I can't believe we're even asking this question. What was achieved by locking her up? Yes. 41:20 Punishment. Punishment. Had she got off... By the way, lads, I thought... 41:25 Sorry, hang on, hang on, hang on. You cannot get off but not be jailed. In other words, you can be found guilty, you can be convicted and get a suspended sentence. That's getting off, lads. It's not. It still gives you a criminal record. It still makes sense. 41:38 And then within the two years, if you commit any crime or come to the attention, you're brought back in. 41:42 For example, Alison Chalk, even if she didn't spend one day in prison, she now can't go to America on her holidays. 41:48 And not everything's about America. 41:50 No, no, no, I know that. But my point is that she has been and she is being punished. My heart's pumping piss for her. 41:57 Answer the question. Jeremy, she can only go to the rest of the world on her toilet yacht. 42:02 Answer the question. What was achieved by giving that woman a custodial sentence? 42:07 Well, nothing now because literally the justice system is after giving us all the two fingers. I have to be honest with you, lads. When that case was sent to sentencing, when they were both found guilty of the crime, I said to you, I said, they won't get custodial sentences. No way they will because they're first offenders and stuff like that. But obviously because of the severity of the crime and the severity of the assault, the assault was horrific. They obviously, there was a message sent out. Exactly. We have to send out a message that just because you're from a millionaire's family, just because you live in a posh house in South County, Dublin, just because you went to a fancy posh school, it's exactly like, you know what it brings me back to, lads? 42:47 And I only read up on it the other day. It brings me back to the whole Annabelle's murder case and how that was treated at that time when that young fella was kicked to death outside Annabelle's. And because half the fellas that went to Blackrock College and they were all posh, rich kids, it looked completely different. We look at crimes completely different when... Again, you've skirted around answering my question. 43:11 What was achieved by jailing that woman? 43:14 You could say that about... What? Really? I'm not even answering that question. Shut up! 43:18 She's not going to re-offend. It's very unlikely she's going to kick somebody in the head again. 43:24 It was a moment of madness. What did we achieve by jailing her? That's a simple question. 43:29 What did we achieve by jailing her? 43:33 You know what you sound like, actually, when you say shit? Hello, McFly. Answer the bloody question. You sound like the barristers that'd be up in the central criminal court every day trying to get their little scumbags off by saying, there's no point in... Please don't jail my client, Your Honour. Please don't jail. He's had a difficult upbringing. She didn't even have a difficult upbringing. There's no excuse for what she did. But because she has a posh accent from a posh area, you're looking at her completely different. If she was a scumbag from Darndale, you wouldn't be saying that. 44:02 I asked you a question. What was achieved by jailing her? 44:06 Justice. Justice. There you go, Jason. Justice was achieved here. 44:11 Pretty expensive justice, but it wasn't. She should have been tagged. She should have been put under coffee or house arrest. 44:18 And I agree. I think that should be used more. I don't know why, for the life of me, we still haven't introduced tagging in this country where every other country in the Western world has it. 44:30 Yeah, yeah. But we need a whole root and branch. Say, look at our justice system and our prison system and our court system and the judges and the solicitors and this fucking free legal aid. This year can rack up 179 convictions, never spend a day in court and get a free legal aid solicitor every single fucking time. We really need a root and branch. Look at the whole justice system because it's broke. And it's only going to get worse. Look what's happening in England. I don't know any of us are up to date what's going on in England. They're literally releasing murderers, rapists and fucking shit. The whole lot. The prisons are just at capacity. 44:59 Yeah, no, I know it's an even worse situation. What I meant to say, when Nathan asked me that question as well, is what did it achieve? Justice for the victims as well. There's two victims in this chalk story. 45:07 It sends out a bit of a message and I don't kick people in the head. But when it's rich, we all know when it's rich. 45:12 Jeremy... 45:14 You talk about re-offending. I'm just speaking to the victims here. Okay, the victims. And yes, there were two people that were seriously assaulted. But do you honestly, genuinely, with your hand in your heart, believe that either of those victims are sitting at home today thinking, oh, fuck, she's out of prison. I'm terrified. No, they're not. 45:32 Adrian, can I ask you a question? 45:34 Yeah, go on. 45:35 Can them victims take the civil suit against what they're doing? 45:37 I believe they are. 45:40 Can you do that in this country? I didn't know you could do that in this country. That's how I'd go. 45:45 We've certainly heard that that could happen. Okay, stay there for a second. I want to go to Maggie. You're on Opinions Matter. How are you, Maggie? 45:57 I'm not too bad. How are you? Good, thanks, Maggie. What did you want to say on this? Do you think it is right that a woman with young children was released from prison one month into a one-year sentence? 46:07 No, totally not. Why? 46:11 Because, basically, she committed a serious crime, okay? It's not like just going in, stealing a can of Red Bull, which I have seen women get in prison. I've never been in prison, thank God. But I don't believe in stealing. But what I'm trying to say is I have seen women, I have raped... like, women who have maybe feeling to feed her kids or whatever, going to prison and doing the full time, maybe get a week beforehand. Like, basically, she got a year. 46:43 She bited a man's face, like, totally. She didn't turn vicious overnight. There had to be something always there, if you get me. Like, you don't turn overnight something like this, you know what I mean? So... 46:56 We don't know her inside life, but basically I'm thinking maybe she is violent. We don't know what it is. To me, she seemed more violent than her brother. 47:05 So my opinion is, no, she did not deserve to get out that early, as I said, just because who she is, where she's from, and she's rich. Yes, I feel sorry for her kids, but she should have told her that before on the night out drinking and having a good time and then decided just to turn vicious and fight with two men. just to kick your hair off the ground and bite him in the face. So basically, that's the opinion. That's how I feel. 47:32 OK, so you don't believe that a woman who has young children should be treated any differently than anybody else, even though Gary Gannon doesn't believe it's the right place for a woman with young children. 47:48 And he is right. It's not the right place for women with young children. But that woman needs to decide that for herself by making the mistake. Like I know, yes, everyone deserves a chance. People make mistakes. But this wasn't just a simple mistake. Do you know what I mean? She'd been out drinking all day. 48:05 Like, what else had she taken to turn the fishes and to do this to a man? 48:12 What if that was a woman and she was up Ireland ambitious and that was a woman she turned on and the woman wouldn't have been as strong as the man. As we know, men are a lot stronger. So, basically, like, What I'm trying to say, I've been through domestic violence, so basically I was never ever as strong as my husband. I'm a victim. I'm gone from that. But if it was a woman that she happened to attack, God knows where that woman could be now. 48:38 No, that's true. We're only speculating it wasn't a woman. It was two men that were subject to the assault in this case. 48:47 But again, you don't believe that a woman guilty of a crime like this should deserve any special treatment for being a mother to three young children? 48:58 Well, basically, like I said, I don't agree, no. But maybe a little while before her sentence was finished, but not how long did you say she, a month into a year sentence? 49:09 Yeah, that's exactly right. 49:10 No way, no way. 49:14 Okay, so she should remain locked up. 49:17 She should remain locked up for a bit longer because has she learned a lesson after a month? I don't know. I don't think so. 49:23 Well, I mean, there was a lot of publicity around the case. It has brought shame on the Chalk family, the fact that both of them. Mind you, one of my slight issues is if this woman was released, it seems a little bit sexist that her brother hasn't been released. He's still locked up. They were both involved in the same crime. They were both convicted at the same time, yet he continues to remain behind bars. 49:52 And he had kids, yes. 49:54 I assume so, I don't know. 49:55 No, I don't actually know if he does or no. He could do, but it never said that during the case. It did say that she had three children. 50:02 But I don't know. But... 50:04 This is about a mother with kids being knocked on. So basically, we don't know if he has kids, okay? So, but what I'm trying to say is, there is other mothers in there for lesser crimes, right? 50:18 And... 50:19 And they have to do their trying. They maybe get out maybe on early release and they also have to do community service or different things. But she just got out completely like, that's it, bye bye, you're finished, you know. So why should she be treated different? Because she's rich from a good family. 50:36 And is that what you see this as? 50:39 Yes, yes, yes. Because Ireland's government is corrupt, as we already know. And yes. And we have seen lots of things happening down. I've been watching a lot of plays with the protesters, which is the crisis going up. So my opinion of it is, yes, it's because of who she is and who she was. She brought shame to the family. But one, either way, she was in prison. She did what she did. So she still has brought shame to herself and her kids more than 51:03 But again, Ireland has always been this way. It always looks on criminals differently depending on what background they're from. And again, if you don't know the Annabelle's case, it was what, 25 years ago probably? 51:14 Google the Annabelle's case and you'll see all the people who were put on their trial. Nobody got justice, by the way. That family, Brian Murphy's family, never got just struck. And then you look even, fast forward a bit to maybe 12 years ago, you look at the way Irish society and the media treated Katie French when she died from drugs. Because Katie French was a posh Southside girl, private school, well-spoken, she was treated completely different to a junkie, and that's not my words, that would die on the side of the street. Remember, politicians turned up at a funeral and all that. 51:46 Someone who died from a drug overdose and you had celebrities and politicians turn up at a funeral. Why? Because she was well-goshed in society. It needs to be called out. It's a two-tier bollock system, Adrian. 52:00 It is, and it's not fair. Nobody has a right to commit crimes or to go around stealing. 52:06 And you don't believe a mother of young children should get any special treatment? 52:12 especially when there's a serious crime. Anything serious at all like that. It wasn't just a little, you know, like, come on, she kicked him on the head, she'd bite you in his face. It was a serious crime. At least she had done half of her time. 52:29 All right, thanks very much indeed. Let me go to Martin. 52:33 That's true, lads. 52:34 Can't make it on. 52:35 Don't do the crime if you can't do the time. Like, what's going to happen then? 52:41 Like, people who write all these fucking drug guns and that are just going to get women with kids to carry a rake of drugs around for them and do all their dirty work because they won't get prison time. 52:50 I mean, like, for fuck's sake. You one should have thought of that before she batted someone. Opinions matter. Opinions matter. 52:58 Kennedy and Jeremy Dixon. A daily podcast from Ireland about opinions. 53:03 Lee, you're on Opinions Matter. How are you, Lee? 53:06 Hiya, how are you? 53:08 Good, thanks, Lee. What did you want to say on this? Do you believe... 53:11 I just want to say with Sarah, your caller that was on there, fair play to her because it takes a lot of guts to tell your story like that and you know, face any judgment or criticism. So that's the first thing I want to say. I think fair play to her. And it sounds like, you know, she's doing great and all the rest of it. So I just want to say that before we say it now. 53:33 Well said. Yep. Okay. So go on. What's your point on this? 53:39 No, I don't think anyone should face exemption because you've got kids. Because, like, you can say the same for dads, you know? I think a parent is a parent. I'm a parent and I feel like anything I do, my first thing is, how will I manage that around my kids? Or if I do that, how will we manage financially, maybe, or whatever the case is. And I've been in courts and like, say, family courts, right? Not in the criminal courts. But judges... 54:10 don't want to be facing people and long lists of people coming in, committing. And like, you know, I've had, I faced good judges and not so good judges. And I feel it is very much on how you get them at what point in the day. I literally feel like they're at their end with, and they're in the position and they should do the job accordingly. And I don't think this lady is, should have got off any earlier for a vicious assault she did at the end of the day because she has kids. 54:42 I think her victims and her kids are the, you know, I feel sorry for the kids in the city. Well, yeah, but and also the fact that you've got my kids caught in the middle of that after that also. Initially, the victims, yes, but you've got children caught in the middle of all this as well. And thankfully, you were saying there that there was a dad there that they didn't have to go into care or they didn't have to be thrown into the system or anything like that. So that's good. Like, you know, at least that's something. 55:11 I just want to, before we wrap it up, I just want to remind people, because a lot of people wouldn't be aware of what this couple, the brother and sister, actually did. And here's from the court report. They set upon the two victims. So the victims' names are Gerard Cox and John McHugh, who were apparently just Well, not apparently. They were just sitting at a bar minding their own business. And they were set upon by the Chalks. The two victims, Gerard Cox and John McHugh, both in their 50s, the Chalks started punching and kicking them. And at one point, they gouged the victim's eyes. 55:43 That's fucking barbaric. Was this totally unprovoked? Yeah, yeah, totally unprovoked. 55:47 You don't read up on the case at the time. I didn't realise it was completely unprovoked. Bill Chalk, that's Alison, initiated the attack, lunging at Mr Cox while Alison Chalk threw a pint glass at both men. 56:01 She bit John McHugh on the face and kicked him in the head, kicked him in the head as her brother wrestled with him on the floor of the foyer of the hotel. There you go, see all the money in the world and all the private educations and all the colleges, they can't buy you a decent bit of fucking class. It's just, it's horrific. It really is horrific. 56:20 And there was... 56:22 Sorry, there was another incident with another person that's well known and there was an older man at the bar and because he wouldn't drink his drink, he attacked him. 56:32 You're talking about the McGregor case. 56:36 Yeah, so that's another example. So no, I don't think any of these people should get away with that. 56:42 You know what I mean? You don't viciously attack anyone. You don't lay your hand on anyone. 56:47 You know what I mean? I just don't understand how anyone with kids comes into it like if anything you'd be concerned okay if this is the behaviour of the parents like are the kids alright and safe if this is how a parent can go off the handle and do an unprovoked attack and a vicious one at that Thankfully there's obviously a dad there and they're with the dad at least and that's something and I don't want to talk about somebody I don't know. 57:15 But no is your answer to special treatment for women with children. No. 57:23 No, because you could apply that to fathers then. A parent is a parent. 57:27 That's something that was already asked. Thank you very much indeed, Lee, for your call. Let me squeeze in one final message on this from Colm. 57:37 I'm with Jeremy on this. 57:40 She got exactly what she deserved. 57:43 She should have known better. 57:45 And the rules are the rules, the laws are the laws. It's not one rule for one and one rule for the other. So, yeah, I'm completely on with Jeremy on this. 57:53 All right, Colm, thank you very much indeed for your message and for your messages throughout this conversation. 58:00 Just as you said something there a few minutes ago, I think it's important to go back on because you said about how did the victims feel and are they worried about these two being released? And during the court case, yeah, The judge acknowledged that Mr Cox and Mr McHugh, they're the two victims, had been entitled to enjoy a night out without interference. They were minding their own business. And they are now living, this is on court record, the two victims are now living with long-term effects of the attack. You don't get over those attacks. PTSD. You get serious, serious PTSD from an attack like that. 58:31 Okay. Before we go today. They were posh, so it's okay. 58:35 Before we go today, we have more of our Opinions Matter travel mugs to give away to one of you listening, or in fact, two of you listening. What are we going to do, Jeremy? How can I win myself a much sought-after Opinions Matter travel book? 58:52 You don't have to win them. I opened your press at home there the other day. There's loads of them, yeah. Loads of them. A whole shelf load. 58:57 And a lot of bottles of Bacardi as well. No, they're moved into a different press because they had to make room for the mugs. Anyway. 59:03 Okay, here's what you do. If you want to be in a chance of winning one of our exclusive branded coffee mugs, all you have to do is WhatsApp the word cup-on-tay Oh, Oscoelga. Yeah, we're going Oscoelga. Because we don't want to give them away to foreign nationals. We're a bit racist here on this podcast. Okay, so we want you to send the words cup on te. I just want to see how people spell it. 59:24 Yeah, but that's what I want. It has to be spelled properly. Yeah. No, I wouldn't know how to spell that. I would. Would you? Yeah. Do you want me to spell it for you? No, no. But the word tea, yeah? Yeah. Is spelled differently. It looks the same initially, but it's not. I've no idea what you just said. Spell tea. 59:41 T-E-A. Yeah, but that's not how you spell it. 59:44 It's a different fucking language. 59:46 But it is nearly identical. Oh, you're such a spa sometimes. 59:49 No, no, no. 59:50 You can't use that word here. What such? The A and the E are reversed. 59:56 Cup on Tay. 59:57 Yeah, what does it just spell the bloody thing? 59:58 Anyway, WhatsApp the word... C-U-P-A-F-A-N-T-A-E. Cup on Tay. Send it in to us right now. To 085-825-2626, we'll put your name into a draw and we will give away another two Opinions Matter travel modes. A draw? What, we have a hat and we're going to pull rabbits out of the hat? No, I do have a hat. There it is over there. It's a lovely hat. Cup on Tay to 085-825-2626. Thanks for listening. We'll catch you on the next episode. 60:26 Need new carpets, flooring, beds, or furniture? Then head to Carpet Luxury Bedding & Furniture, where great value comes as standard. Don't miss their famous €500 stairs and landing package deal, covering up to 16 square yards of quality carpet, supplied and fitted. Looking for a modern update? Check out their fantastic range of laminate flooring and vinyls, available in a variety of styles to suit every home and budget. 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